Take the Tithing Test
Take the following True or False quiz to see how much your really understand about tithing. We predict that many of you will be surprised. Record your answers.
1. The Lord Jesus Christ would have tithed. True or False?
2. Simon Peter, originally a fisherman, would have tithed of the fish that he caught. True or False?
3. Everyone in the Old Testament seeking to obey the Law of Moses would have tithed. True or False?
4. Abraham tithed to Melchizedek in the same way that believers tithe to the Lord Jesus Christ. True or False?
5. The Lord Jesus Christ taught His disciples that they should tithe. True or False?
6. There are many examples of people tithing of their incomes in the Bible. True or False?
7. The New Testament teaches that we should tithe to ministers in the same way that Jews tithed to the Priests.
True or False?
8. The Bible teaches that God’s standard for giving is tenpercent. True or False?
9. The righteous poor tithed in the Old Testament. True or False?
10. Since everyone is held to the same standard, tithing is fair to everyone. True or False?
Bonus Question. The Bible teaches that everyone should give ten-percent of their ongoing income. True or False?
Here are the answers.
1. The Lord Jesus Christ would have tithed of His income. This one is false. The Lord Jesus Christ was a carpenter by profession and then after He became 30 years old He was a preacher and teacher. Neither of these professions was required by the Law of Moses to tithe anything.
2. Simon Peter, originally a fisherman, would have tithed of the fish that he caught. This one is false also. Fishermen were not required to tithe anything either. There were only two kinds of professions in ancient Israel that were required to tithe. Farmers and husbandmen (shepherds and cattle herders) were the only tithers in ancient Israel. They only tithed the food they produced.
3. Everyone in the Old Testament seeking to obey the Law of Moses would have tithed. It should be evident by now that this one is false also. There were many people with other professions who were not required by the Law to tithe. For instance, the apostle Paul being a tent-maker was not required to tithe. In fact, none of the Twelve apostles would have been tithers because none of them came from the required professions.
4. Abraham tithed to Melchizedek in the same way that believers tithe to the Lord Jesus Christ. This one is false also. Abraham’s tithe was very different than what the Church practices today. For instance, Abraham only tithed once. The Church tithes continually. Abraham tithed of the spoils of a war. The Church tithes of its income. Abraham had no increase because he gave the other 90% of the spoils of the war back to the original owner. The Church tithes of its increase. There is no commandment or any logic or indication in the New Testament that believers are to tithe anything to the Lord Jesus Christ. Believers are to give generously as God blesses them and whatever is in their heart according to Paul (2 Corinthians 9:7, 1 Corinthians 16:1-2).
5. The Lord Jesus Christ taught His disciples that they should tithe. False. Christ only makes three statements about tithing. None of these statements say that His disciples should tithe anything. Christ first statement, repeated in two Gospels, is spoken to the Pharisees not to His disciples. (Mattthew 23:23, Luke 11:42) In that statement, Christ says that the Pharisees should continue to tithe mint, dill and cummin. This is a tithe of food not money. He also says that this tithe of food is a part of the Law and says that it is not even an important part of the Law. His other statement is about a self-righteous Pharisee bragging that he tithes. Christ says that the other man who was not tithing who humbled himself was justified in the sight of God. The selfrighteous tither was not justified in the sight of God. This is hardly an encouragement for Christ’s disciples to tithe money.
6. There are many examples of people tithing of their incomes in the Bible. False. In 4000 years of recorded biblical history there is not a single example of what the Church practices today in tithing money. There are two one-time acts of tithing recorded before the Law. Neither man, Abraham or Jacob, seems to think that they should continue this process beyond the one-time act. Neither man is tithing of their income since each is only involved in a one-time act. Abraham is tithing of the spoils of a war. Neither man seems to teach their children to tithe. All the other tithing recorded in the Bible is found in the Law of Moses. In the Law, money was never used to tithe only food. In fact, when someone wanted to use money rather than bring the produce to Jerusalem, God required a 20% penalty to be added. (Leviticus 27:30-31) In other words, God discouraged the tithing of money.
7. The New Testament teaches that we should tithe to ministers in the same way that Jews tithed to the Priests. False. The New Testament has nothing at all to say about this. This is extra-biblical logic that is not found in the New Testament. In fact, the Book of Hebrews makes it clear that believers are not of the Levitical order of priests. Believers are of a higher order, the order of Melchizedek.
8. The Bible teaches that God’s standard for giving is tenpercent. False. Neither the Old Testament nor the New Testament teaches this. This is extra-biblical logic again. First of all, the food tithe in the Old Testament was not ten-percent. It was actually more like 23% annually on average. There were three tithes in the Law of Moses. The first tithe was paid only by agrarian families three times yearly at the feasts to the Priests in Jerusalem. The second tithe was saved by the agrarian families to support these trips. It was called the festival tithe. It was for a family vacation. The third tithe was given every three years to the local storehouse, so it amounted to about 3% annually. This was the poor tithe collected for those in need. This is the tithe that Malachi wrote about. None of these tithes were money. They were only food. Those who earned their livings by other occupations did
not pay a tithe of anything. However, they did give offerings required by the Law some of which were in silver, gold, bronze and copper coins. Nowhere does the New Testament change this legal obligation of tithing food for some agrarian Israelites in the Law to money tithing for all Christians. This transformation of the food tithe to a money tithe is done by teaching that our harvest is our income and bringing us under a spiritualized form of the Law
of Moses.
9. The righteous poor tithed in the Old Testament. False. The poor had no harvest or flocks to tithe from. They were able to glean the corners of the field of those who were more prosperous.
10. Since everyone is held to the same standard, tithing is fair to everyone. False. Tithing is incredibly unfair. Ten-percent of the income of a poor person is a great burden, while ten-percent of the income of a rich person may be no burden at all. If a person only has a $1000 a month income, then $100 of that income will affect their lifestyle and may even impact their ability to take care of their children’s basic needs and pay their bills. If a person has a $10,000 a month income then giving $1,000 per month should have little affect on their lifestyle since they should have a good amount of disposable income beyond their basic needs. If a person has a $100,000 a month income, then $10,000 a month has no appreciable affect on their lifestyle at all. Some continue to teach tithing to poor persons by arguing that if the poor person will give ten-percent of their income then God will bless them. However, coming under a spiritualized form of the Law will hinder God’s blessing in finances. The poor should simply obey the Lord as He guides them in giving.
Bonus Question. The Bible teaches that everyone should give ten-percent of their ongoing income. False. The modern practice of tithing has five basic elements expressed as everyone gives 10% of ongoing income. How do Bible facts about tithing actually fit with this teaching? Let’s compare and contrast the modern teaching of tithing with the Bible.
Everyone gives 10% of ongoing income. Considering the “Everyone” element.
The two events before the Law do not support the idea that everyone should pay tithe. Only Abraham and Jacob in each situation are paying tithe. Genesis doesn’t record anyone else tithing. Abraham and Jacob don’t seem to teach their children to tithe. One of Jacob’s children, Joseph, is a particularly righteous man. In the more than ten detailed chapters devoted to Joseph, we don’t discover him tithing either. Not everyone tithed in Genesis before the Law.
In the Law of Moses, not everyone was required to tithe or give firstfruits. Only those who were actually growing food or raising sheep or cattle were required by the Law to tithe the food or present firstfruits. People from other occupations were not required to tithe since they had no harvest or growth of flocks to tithe or to present firstfruits from. Not everyone tithed food who lived under the Law. No one under the Law tithed money at all. Christ has only a few words to say about tithing. In those words, Christ does not say that everyone should tithe. He says that unbelieving Jews living under the Law should tithe food if they are growing it. He mentions three food plants. Christ is not addressing His disciples. He is addressing unbelieving Pharisees. the apostle Paul does not teach that everyone is obligated to tithe or to even to give. He teaches that giving is completely voluntary. The first apostolic council in Acts Chapter 15 does not say that Gentile believers should tithe either. There is absolutely no evidence that any Gentile Christian in the First Century ever tithed anything. Here is what the Encyclopedia Americana says about the history of tithing: "It was not practiced in the early Christian church but gradually became common (in the Roman Catholic church in western Europe) by the 6th Century. The Council of Tours in 567 and the second Council of Macon in 585 advocated tithing. Made obligatory by civil law in the Carolingian empire in 765 and in England in the 10th Century... The Reformation did not abolish tithing and the practice was continued in the Roman Catholic church and in Protestant countries... (until it was) gradually replaced by other forms of taxation. The Roman Catholic church still prescribes tithes in countries where they are sanctioned by law, and some Protestant bodies consider tithes obligatory." The Encyclopedia Britannica points this out about tithing... "The eastern Orthodox churches never accepted the idea of tithes and Orthodox church members have never paid them."
Everyone gives 10% of ongoing income. Considering the “gives” element. The two events before the Law do seem like giving. They are both voluntary acts. God does not require either man, Abraham or Jacob, to give anything. While this does on the surface seem to support the tithing teaching, it actually contradicts some aspects of the Tithing Obligation teaching. While the proponents of tithing teach that tithing is giving, they also often teach that tithing is required, that a tithe must be paid. Of course, this is a contradiction in their teaching. Something can be only given if it is entirely voluntary. If it is required, then it is, in this case, a fee for spiritual services or a religious tax. If some teach that a believer comes under a curse if they do not tithe, then they are not teaching giving but teaching paying an obligated tithe. Of course, they are right in one sense because they are often spiritualizing the Law of Moses to teach tithing. Tithing in the Law of Moses was never giving. It was much more like paying taxes. The Law of Moses required tithing by farmers and husbandmen. They would not have seen their tithing as giving. There was nothing voluntary in their paying tithe. They would have been in violation of the Law if they had not done it. Again, Christ has very little to say about tithing. He did say that Jewish people living under the Law pay tithe. Christ does teach a great deal about finances and giving but never instructs His disciples to tithe money or anything else. He does not instruct them to receive tithes either. Paul writes a great deal about finances and giving but never instructs anyone to tithe or to receive tithes. The first apostolic council in Acts Chapter 15 is silent on the subject of tithing and establishes that Gentiles are not to keep any aspects of the Law of Moses, even spiritualization of the Law. That would include tithing of anything.
Everyone gives 10% of ongoing income. Considering the “10%” element.
The two events before the Law of Moses do seem to support the idea that ten percent of something should be given. The number ten is the same. However, the other four elements are significantly different. This makes tithing being practiced by the Church very different from what is happening in Genesis. The only similarity is the ten percent number. Christ does validate the ten-percent number but only for Jews living under the Law of Moses. He tells the Pharisees that they should pay tithe, ten percent, of their produced food. He also tells them that paying ten-percent is not a weighty matter of the Law. In saying this, Christ does tell us that tithing is a matter of the Law. The apostle Paul repeatedly warns believers about the curse of the Law. Gentile believers should not attempt to keep any aspects of the Law. Believers are not required to give ten-percent of food or anything else. The writings of the other apostles, James and Peter, are silent about Christians giving ten percent of food or
anything else.
Everyone gives 10% of ongoing income. Considering the “ongoing” element. The two examples before the Law of Moses do not reveal the practice of on-going tithing. They both appear strongly to be one-time acts. In the case of Jacob, we don’t know exactly what he did but it does seem that he is promising to tithe once if God blesses him. Of course, this is exactly opposite of what the Church teaches. The Church teaches that that God will bless us if we tithe. Jacob says he will tithe if God blesses him. The Church’s practice of ongoing, repetitious tithing simply cannot be validated by two one-time acts. They are not similar to what the Church teaches about tithing. The only place in the Bible where ongoing, repetitious tithing can be found is in the Law of Moses. Those who were farming or practicing husbandry in Israel had a lifetime obligation to tithe the food that they produced. This ongoing food tithe to support the Mosaic Levitical ministry is often borrowed from the Law and spiritualized to justify repetitious money tithing in support of Christian ministry. This justification is not found in the New Testament. Christ’s statement about tithing reveals that the ongoing tithing of food is under the Law. Christ says nothing about His disciples practicing ongoing tithing of anything. While the writings of the apostles in the New Testament often speak of generous giving, they are silent about ongoing tithing of anything. The first apostolic council is also silent about ongoing tithing of anything but releases Gentile believers from any aspects of keeping the Law of Moses.
Everyone gives 10% of ongoing income. Considering the “income” element.
Abraham tithes on the spoils of war, not his entire income. Abraham tithed the captured belongings of his defeated enemies. Additionally, Genesis reveals that Abraham didn’t even keep the ninety percent that was remaining. He returned those possessions to the King of Sodom. Abraham’s income, his possessions or any part of his own wealth wasn’t involved at all in his tithing. He had no increase to tithe on. In Jacob’s case, we don’t know exactly what he did since all Genesis records is his promise to God. In other words, there is no support in the events before the Law that Christians should give ten percent of their ongoing income. Nearly everyone that teaches tithing resorts to using the Law and prophets living under the Law to teach it. Those that teach Christian tithing from the Law often neglect to reveal that only food produced was tithed on but never money. Only those who earned their livings by producing food tithed at all. Those Israelites who earned money by other means such as tent making, weaving, carpentry, money lending, fishing or many other occupations never tithed on their incomes since it was not commanded of them. Christ does not change tithing food to tithing money. The writings of the apostles do not change tithing food to tithing money. The apostolic council releases the Gentile believers from any keeping of the Law. They certainly do not change tithing food to tithing money. The book of Hebrews does mention the Old Testament tithing of food but does not validate tithing money for believers today. Finally, it should be obvious to the reader that this doctrine is pieced together from these various passages. Not a single passage in itself actually teaches what the Church practices today. Spiritualization of the Law is used to teach tithing. Reasoning that is not found in the Bible is used to justify Christians embracing a legalistic practice from the Old Testament. In more than 4000 years of recorded Biblical history, there is not a single recorded example of tithing that is similar to what the Church practices today. We recommend that every Christian renounce this unscriptural practice and reject any lingering fear, guilt or condemnation! God’s children have no debt to their Father to pay other than thanksgiving and praise. Their elder brother, the Lord Jesus Christ, has paid in full the debt. Christ will build His Church but only with the truth. He needs no help from a false doctrine that puts the Children of God under bondage to fear and the curse of the Law. The children are free! A portion of this booklet was taken from Dr. Sapp’s book “The Children are Free” the third book in the “Paid in Full” Financial Series.
All Nations Ministries
Revealing God's grace and truth to a confused church, the unbelieving and a dying world.
Sunday, July 25, 2010
Thursday, July 22, 2010
Is Ignorance Bliss or is it just Plain Ignorant?
I recently posted this video link on my facebook profile and a few people had some great comments. However, this one particular woman that I know, who is supposedly a Pastor, commented on this post and said, "What a mockery."
Here is the video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GnRTfjPohYw&feature=autofb
or
These are the lyrics:
"Oh Lord my God when I am in awesome wonder I consider all the worlds thy hands have made. I see the stars, I hear the rolling thunder. Thy power throughout the universe displayed And when I think that God his Son not sparing, Sent Him to die, I scarce can take it in that on that cross my burden gladly bearing. He bled and died to take away my sin. When Christ shall come with shout of acclamation and take me home, what joy shall fill my heart. Then I shall bow in humble adoration and there proclaim my God how great Thou art. (Then sings my soul) HOW GREAT THOU ART! MY GOD HOW GREAT THOU ART!"
Is this mockery or is the just a different form of music? I say it is not mockery but glorification of God, just in a genre of music that she was not used to hearing and possible very unfamiliar with. Well, this is our conversation.
Woman Pastor: "what a mockery!"
Me: "This really hurts guys. Just because "How great Thou Art" has been redone in a style or genre you are not familiar with or do not like, doesn't mean it's a mockery or a bad version; that is a matter of opinion and you know how opinions are.
Its just that you don't like it, its not your preference; I understand that and that's fine. I don't expect you to like it and if you don't, thats ok too. My whole point in this was to show that people who play this genre of music, can still worship God, praise Him and give glory to God without the traditional style or genre of accompaniment.
But, please don't call this version a "mockery" because its not. A mockery would be making fun of it. A "mockery" would mean ridicule, scorn, derision, contempt, disdain, sarcasm and jeering. I'm sorry, but I don't see that here. What I see is a Christian band singing a traditional song in a different style that what you are used to.
*Woman Pastor,* if singing 'How Great Thou Art" in ANY form is mockery, then your god is not my God. Are you telling that me that there's only one way to sing a song? Is there only one way to worship Christ? Is there only one way to preach the gospel? Is there only one group of people deserving of salvation?"
Me, again: "One more thing, *Woman Pastor.* You call your self a pastor? lol
I don't think so deary, you have alot to learn and a long, long way to go sister!
Real pastors don't go around spreading doubt and cynicism within the universal church of Christ. You need to be OPEN and encouraging, no matter WHO you come across. Jesus would have never condemned a style of music as long as it glorified God!
Matthew 12:30 - “Anyone who isn’t with me opposes me, and anyone who isn’t working with me is actually working against me."
Mark 9:38-41 "John said to Jesus, “Teacher, we saw someone using your name to cast out demons, but we told him to stop because he wasn’t in our group.” “Don’t stop him!” Jesus said. “No one who performs a miracle in my name will soon be able to speak evil of me. Anyone who is not against us is for us. If anyone gives you even a cup of water because you belong to the Messiah, I tell you the truth, that person will surely be rewarded."
A simple cup of water!!!!!! (omg, someone stop me!)
*Woman Pastor,* just because you have some sort of hatred or anger against me or the metal music I like, does not mean that its wrong. If people who like metal music worship Jesus, glorify him or revise old traditional hymns are FOR CHRIST, then what the heck is the problem?!"
Woman Pastor: "Wow whos judging now? Interesting Matthew 24:10 you should read it."
Woman Pastor,again: "I have no hatred or anger against you I can honestly say I love you. Thats why I tell the truth. Im not led by my emotions or how someone hurt me or victomize myself. I can take ur critisizum because I live to please God and not man. Im not trying to pick a fight. There must be truth to what Im saying Im obviously hitting a nerve."
My Wife: *Woman Pastor* the only truth to this point is that you dont like the same music! I am sure if this could be forwarded to this band they would be able to come back and defend their own music, but because that is not the case and you came on an attack with the statement "what a mockery" this was all you picking the fight. If you dont like it don't listen to it and don't comment. Anything Jason [Me]puts on here in regards to music you always have to come and make a negative comment this is not something you expect out of a pastor. So no there is no truth to what you are saying it is strickly a matter of opinion.
In the word it says: Do not let unwholesome talk come out of your mouths, but only what is helpful for building others up according to their needs, that it may benefit those that listen. Eph 4:29
In this verse it says their needs not the needs of our own. *Woman Pastor* its time that you stop shuting out what is around you and start learning from it you may need it to one day spread the word of God to someone that would shut you out because of who you are a Pastor."
Woman Pastor: "Unwholesome talk did u read ur husbands words in his conversation about "Why is it that rap music is excepted ..." [this is my status on facebook, please see my status below] calling people old bags come on *my wife* why is it the truth in love is so hard to take.. There is a spirit of anger and rage behind that music in these last days we got to discerned Jesus said in Matt 24 do NOT be decieved and just cause I say something that isnt all mushy so called love doesnt mean its not love my friend love is strong unmovable a firm foundation sorry if it offends you. Blessing"
My Wife: "Yes I read what my husband said and he was angry I will not doubt that but you are a pastor you need to think before you speak. *Woman Pastor* best I can say for you is to not comment when you dont like something no one forced you to listen to it no one forced you to comment. Jason [Me] will reach souls if that is what Christ wants for him if he did not then this band would have not had the blessings that they have had. I have read some lyrics and have heard some testimonoes from these national bands and they are saving souls for the kingdom so please don't judge what you don't know."
Woman Pastor: "Sooo it is justifiable if ur husband calls names but if I because Im a Pastor tell the truth that obviously you both dont want to hear.(as its plastered on FB) Im all wrong a pastor shouldn't do that??? My judge is God not man. Sorry if you cant handle some one disagreeing.Or handle truth in love. I think ur hurts need to heal. And that happens by choosing forgivness for pat offenses not holding on to them and spewing hate. Blessings"
Me: "I read Matthew 24:10 and it doesn’t apply in this case because I haven’t turned away from Christ, I have never betrayed you and I don’t hate you.
As far as judging you, I am allowed to do that. I’m just not allowed to judge unbelievers, those who are outsiders of the church.
1 Corinthians 5:13-13 “It isn’t my responsibility to judge outsiders, but it certainly is your responsibility to judge those inside the church who are sinning. God will judge those on the outside.”
When you are prejudice against something you do not understand, you are being ungodly. Ungodliness is sinful and we should not be prejudice, or pre-judging, unless you have all the facts.
James 2:9 - “If you favor some people over others, you are committing a sin.” This does not apply just for people alone but being prejudice against anything, is ungodly.
John 7:24 - “Look beneath the surface so you can judge correctly.”
God is not partial towards the Greek or the Jew, rich or the poor. There is no favoritism in Him. But, for you to say that one particular style of music is evil and another is good is being prejudice. The fact is that styles of music cannot be evil or good, only people can be evil or good, not music. Music is a matter of preference, that’s it. Now, what people do with the music, such as adding evil lyrics and talking about evil and ungodly things, is a different matter. But, in this case the lyrics are righteous and godly.
You have not told the truth about anything except the truth about yourself. You have exposed yourself as being a hypocrite. You assume the role of a Pastor but you condemn others and their taste in music and what they do. You have done nothing but inadvertently condemned my band, our music and our ministry in a negative light. No wonder there will be thousands of "metal heads" in hell! Because people like you rejected them! Who are you to choose who goes to heaven and who goes to hell?
Angry emotions are not a bad thing. Jesus was led by his emotions when he got angry at the money changers in the Temple. He started turning over tables, yelling and screaming and trying to kick them all out! Was Jesus justified? Of course, because those people were wrong!
In 1 Samuel 11:6, “Then the Spirit of God came powerfully upon Saul, and he became very angry.” If God can make a man angry, then gosh darn it, it must be justified!
When people like you condemn ministries that reach out to the un-churched youth with the good news of Christ by means of metal music, I am justified in my anger because it’s wrong! It’s wrong to reject God working through us or any other Christian metal band to reach these lost people.
When churches reject a Christian metal band from showing up at an event because they growl, scream or have loud guitars and drums who come with Christian based lyrics, preaching the gospel and giving their testimonies of how God has changed their lives, then those churches are wrong! Who are they to reject a Christian ministry that reaches those who do listen to that kind of music? To do that, is prejudice! Remember, John 7:24 - “Look beneath the surface so you can judge correctly.”
Yeah, the only nerve you struck was the nerve of truth by exposing ignorant people like you who don’t know what the heck your doing leading a supposed “church.”
If you truly lived to please God then it would matter what people said about Christian metal music. If you really lived to please God you would rebuke those who speak against spreading the good news of Christ through this style of music and the testimonies of the band members. If you wanted to truly please God then you would defend ministries that are “on God’s side” that’s goal is to evangelize and reach those kids who will probably never step foot in an uppity, snooty, religious and condemning church. The usual response to those kinds of people and churches is, “Your hair is too long, your clothes are too freaky, you have a piercing on your eyebrow and lips, you have too many tattoos, you growl in your songs, you scream words and we can’t understand the lyrics, sorry you cannot be saved, you heathen; burn in hell!”
You should take this criticism as revealing because I come across people and churches like this all the time. They are negative, condemning and combative. They never uplift, they are not positive or encouraging. They mock what they do not understand and reject the true power of God working in the lives of the underground church. You scoff at what you do not know and you should humble yourself, repent and ask God to forgive you for your cynicism and negative attitude."
Me, again: "*Woman Pastor,*
Look, calling someone an “old bag” is not a sin, so get over it. Jesus called the Pharisees a “brood of vipers” right in front of their faces! However, when someone calls themselves a Pastor, they are held to a higher standard than the average church-going Christian who sits in the pews; you lost that privilege when you became a Pastor.
I live for the truth and I always support it. However, the only truth you presented here was exposing your negative and discouraging attitude towards a particular style of music that you do not like. If you simply would have said in the beginning, “Great lyrics but I don’t care for the style.” Then no harm done. However, when you mocked the style of music (which is what you really did) that I like with a statement like “What a mockery,” then I’m not going to let that go. Why? Because it’s a lie! This music, along with the wonderful lyrics are not a mockery but they glorify God; fully and wholly.
As I stated with *an old Navy friend of mine* and as anyone can see, I can disagree; I don’t have a problem with that! If you don’t particularly like this genre, I can understand that; but what you did was wrong and you need to repent. I have already forgiven you because you don’t know what you are doing by saying foolish things like that. I am not hurt as much as you think. However, my anger is justified because of what people say about things they are ignorant of. This is not hate towards you; I have no reason to hate you! However, I have concern for religious dogmatics like yourself who cannot see past the four walls of you church building. There are thousands of people out here dying and going to hell because churches and people like you ignore them or reject them because it’s not your style of music. Omgosh, get over it! I don’t like Country music, but I’m not going to reject it if it brings people to Christ! I just don’t prefer to listen to it. I would never mock it or condemn it because I didn’t like the style of music.
If hardcore/metal core bands brings people to know Christ by planting seeds of hope, watering those people with positive messages through the lyrics and great testimonies at shows and then offering a message of hope in a lost world by praying with these to receive Christ people in a concert, then why would any Christian speak badly or negative of it?!
Please burn me at the stake! I will scream and growl in the famous words of Joan of Arc, “Jesus, Jesus, Jesus!"
My 13yr. old Daughter: "I dislike people who judge, that means that the don't have anything else to do with there life but criticize people who are different from them.
*Woman Pastor, You being a pastor should accept people for who they are and what type of music they like, it doesn't make them any different from any of the rest of the people.
Hate is a strong word, To have a great aversion to, with a strong desire that evil should befall the person toward whom the feeling is directed; to dislike intensely; to detest; as, to hate one's enemies; to hate hypocrisy.
My pastor makes mistake and he admits them, on the podium.
He asks for forgiveness, he thanks God for forgiveness, he LOVES his church family. He may not like my father's music but he knows that its bringing other souls to the Lord.
I personally love my dad's music. My friend's don't like it, they are glad my dad's band is moving forward.
I'm defending my parents because I know they are Godly people who love God and love God's people.
God made everybody DIFFERENT in their own way!
I think we should respect that."
My Wife: "Well *Woman Pastor* as i have read in what Jason [Me] responded he never once called you names. You are wrong a pastor should not act this way. I have no hurts that need healing eithermaybe looking at yourself before making accusations is what needs to happen. I am in a loving relationship and as Christ tells us to be the loving support to our husbands and i am following that. I beleive that this is pointless to continue with you and I will not respond any further if you choose to come back then it will only be making you the pastor look childish "plastered here on facebook". I know the relationship that I myself, my husband, and my children have with Christ and I need not defend this anymore. Thank you and have a nice life."
Woman Pastor: "hmmmm interesting! Ill be praying for u all God bless."
Me: "Wow! Your piety and arrogance still shines through; even when you are completely speechless."
Woman Pastor: ";)"
Well, that's it folks. What a poor example of a Pastor with no backbone, no humility and absolutley no concern for truth or the unsaved. I'm not re-posting this to ruin her. I'm doing this to OPEN your eyes and her eyes too!! Wake up America, your life will pass you by and your meaning in life will too if you do not answer the call and bury your hatred and prejudices!
My Status on Monday at 5:19 pm, 2010: "Why is it that Christian Rap is accepted, Christian Rock is accepted, Christian Country is accepted but when you mention the word Christian "metal," everyone freaks out and calls you a demonic band? I just don't get it."
Me: "When people hear a vocalist scream, yell or growl (whatever you want to call it) they automatically associate this type of vocalization of words with demons. The problem is, I can't figure out why?
What I want to know is, have these people ever heard a real demon scream? I mean seriously, I have never come across a demon in my lifetime... See More, at least as far as I know, and I certainly have never heard an actually demon scream or growl. So, do we really know what demons sound like and do we we even know that they scream? These are all stupid questions.
My point is that the music, the sound, the guitar, the vocals or the noise coming from a group of guys playing instruments loudly and fast does not qualify as demonic. At the very least it may qualify as terrible to some folks but demonic, I don't think so. Seriously, have we ever seen a real band of demons? Last time I checked, there has never been an actual band that had actual demons from hell, win a grammy for "Best Demonic Band?" Gimme a frigg'n break!
I guess it's Hollywood's fault. They have personified demonic voices in movies so much that when people hear a scream or growl, its automatically assumed that it's got to be demonic, even though they haven't a clue of what is being actually spoken!
I can scream or growl John 3:16 to an audience and someone will say, "Ohh, that's demonic! It must be bad because I can't understand it! Rediculous. :-("
Woman Pastor: "wow calling people old bags and idiots Matthew 5:22 amp! But i say to you (Jesus Speaking) that everyone who continues to be angry with his brother or harbors malice (enmity of heart) against him shall be liable to and unable to escape the punishment imposed by the Sanhedrin, and whoever says, you fool! [You empty headed idiot!] shall be liable to and unable to escape the hell(Gehenna) of fire!
matthew 24 do not be decieved!!! Everyone saying Lord Lord will enter the kingdom! Jason ask ur self why ur so angry and this "music" u defend sooo passionitly feeds your anger. Let God heal your hurts and heart. its not about the music its about your heart!"
Me: "As I stated in my other post, calling people "old bags" is not a sin. Even calling someone an "idiot" is not a sin. Matthew 5:22 says, "If you call someone an idiot, you are in danger of being brought before the court."
All this says is that my actions of calling someone an idiot, may be out of line. However, I feel I am justified because anybody who continues in discussing things they are clearly clueless about, must be an idiot or just plain stupid. Jesus clearly called the Pharisees plenty of names and he said it to their faces! So, if Jesus can say it, then I can say it. If he is justified, then I am justified.
I'm not angry at my brother and anyone else for that matter. I am angry at the fact that people like you make ignorant comments on things that they are clueless about. You don't know anything about Christian metal. You "think" you know something, but who do you think knows more, you or me? I am in a band that plays it, I attend the concerts and I see people being influenced for Christ. I see people giving testimonies of how Christ changed their lives and now they live to serve Christ. I have even seen "unbelievers" worshipping God! Try that at church next Sunday!
What have you seen? Absolutely nothing and only what you want to see because you don't want to see the truth of the gospel of Christ working in the lives of these people. Like I said, you are clueless.
If someone makes a comment about something that they have no earthly idea of what they are talking about, and they continue to discuss it, then they are truly an idiot! If you don't have enough common sense to shut up about something you don't know anything about, then you are an idiot.
The music I listen to does NOT feed my anger (in which I have none), what makes me justifiably angry are people who think they know better than God. I am angry at what Jesus got angry about, which is pride, arrogance, piety and people who are so self-righteous, they can't even see their own failures.
The reason I am now able to express my true thoughts to you is because I am no longer afraid of man. Once you come to intimate knowledge of, understand and know the fear of God, man is no more a threat to me. I could care less what any man thinks of me because I know what God thinks of me and what He thinks of me is all that matters. I don't care if you hate me, I don't care what any man thinks of me. I am not here to please man, I aim to please God and what He has for me in my life.
I am healed in Jesus name and I don't need you telling what's wrong with me, I have Jesus for that. Jesus has changed my heart. That's why I am telling you these truths that you need to pay attention too!
As I stated before, I do NOT hate you or anyone else. I am NOT angry at anyone, only the situation. If it's not about the music, then why did you call "How Great Thou Art" by Becoming the Archtype a "mockery?"
Yes, it's not about the music, that's what I have been trying to tell you!It's about Jesus, nothing else!
I just want you to know one thing, it is completely out of love that I've said this."
This something I want to point out. Woman Pastor originally says, "What a mockery" about the music video I posted. Then much later on my status, she says "its not about the music its about your heart!" If it's not about then the music then whay did she say, "What a mockery" in the beginning of this conversation?
I can tell you why. It's because she is a liar and a hypocrite. She focuses strictly on the music and does not even consider the lyrics. Let's face it, she does not like "metal" music! Why doesn't she just admit it?!
You see folks, these kind of so-called "Christians" are the false ones. They pretend to be Christian but underneath, they judge people, have prejudices against certain types of music, certain clothes you wear, certain types of tattoos, etc, etc, and if you don't fit inside their little mold that they have created in their own little perfect religious world then you must not be worthy of salvation, even though Christ thought different.
One day in heaven, God will ask Woman Pastor, "Why did you reject these people because of the type of music they listened too? Didn't someone tell you that this was all about my Son, Jesus the Christ, the Messiah? Why didn't you listen and gain understanding from this situation? Did not my words of truth reign in your heart? Or, did you worry too much about your preferences and what you liked versus what I gave you to use? My dear child, you are a selfish one, into the consuming fire with you and pray that your deeds and works are not consumed as purely stubble and hay."
Here is the video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GnRTfjPohYw&feature=autofb
or
These are the lyrics:
"Oh Lord my God when I am in awesome wonder I consider all the worlds thy hands have made. I see the stars, I hear the rolling thunder. Thy power throughout the universe displayed And when I think that God his Son not sparing, Sent Him to die, I scarce can take it in that on that cross my burden gladly bearing. He bled and died to take away my sin. When Christ shall come with shout of acclamation and take me home, what joy shall fill my heart. Then I shall bow in humble adoration and there proclaim my God how great Thou art. (Then sings my soul) HOW GREAT THOU ART! MY GOD HOW GREAT THOU ART!"
Is this mockery or is the just a different form of music? I say it is not mockery but glorification of God, just in a genre of music that she was not used to hearing and possible very unfamiliar with. Well, this is our conversation.
Woman Pastor: "what a mockery!"
Me: "This really hurts guys. Just because "How great Thou Art" has been redone in a style or genre you are not familiar with or do not like, doesn't mean it's a mockery or a bad version; that is a matter of opinion and you know how opinions are.
Its just that you don't like it, its not your preference; I understand that and that's fine. I don't expect you to like it and if you don't, thats ok too. My whole point in this was to show that people who play this genre of music, can still worship God, praise Him and give glory to God without the traditional style or genre of accompaniment.
But, please don't call this version a "mockery" because its not. A mockery would be making fun of it. A "mockery" would mean ridicule, scorn, derision, contempt, disdain, sarcasm and jeering. I'm sorry, but I don't see that here. What I see is a Christian band singing a traditional song in a different style that what you are used to.
*Woman Pastor,* if singing 'How Great Thou Art" in ANY form is mockery, then your god is not my God. Are you telling that me that there's only one way to sing a song? Is there only one way to worship Christ? Is there only one way to preach the gospel? Is there only one group of people deserving of salvation?"
Me, again: "One more thing, *Woman Pastor.* You call your self a pastor? lol
I don't think so deary, you have alot to learn and a long, long way to go sister!
Real pastors don't go around spreading doubt and cynicism within the universal church of Christ. You need to be OPEN and encouraging, no matter WHO you come across. Jesus would have never condemned a style of music as long as it glorified God!
Matthew 12:30 - “Anyone who isn’t with me opposes me, and anyone who isn’t working with me is actually working against me."
Mark 9:38-41 "John said to Jesus, “Teacher, we saw someone using your name to cast out demons, but we told him to stop because he wasn’t in our group.” “Don’t stop him!” Jesus said. “No one who performs a miracle in my name will soon be able to speak evil of me. Anyone who is not against us is for us. If anyone gives you even a cup of water because you belong to the Messiah, I tell you the truth, that person will surely be rewarded."
A simple cup of water!!!!!! (omg, someone stop me!)
*Woman Pastor,* just because you have some sort of hatred or anger against me or the metal music I like, does not mean that its wrong. If people who like metal music worship Jesus, glorify him or revise old traditional hymns are FOR CHRIST, then what the heck is the problem?!"
Woman Pastor: "Wow whos judging now? Interesting Matthew 24:10 you should read it."
Woman Pastor,again: "I have no hatred or anger against you I can honestly say I love you. Thats why I tell the truth. Im not led by my emotions or how someone hurt me or victomize myself. I can take ur critisizum because I live to please God and not man. Im not trying to pick a fight. There must be truth to what Im saying Im obviously hitting a nerve."
My Wife: *Woman Pastor* the only truth to this point is that you dont like the same music! I am sure if this could be forwarded to this band they would be able to come back and defend their own music, but because that is not the case and you came on an attack with the statement "what a mockery" this was all you picking the fight. If you dont like it don't listen to it and don't comment. Anything Jason [Me]puts on here in regards to music you always have to come and make a negative comment this is not something you expect out of a pastor. So no there is no truth to what you are saying it is strickly a matter of opinion.
In the word it says: Do not let unwholesome talk come out of your mouths, but only what is helpful for building others up according to their needs, that it may benefit those that listen. Eph 4:29
In this verse it says their needs not the needs of our own. *Woman Pastor* its time that you stop shuting out what is around you and start learning from it you may need it to one day spread the word of God to someone that would shut you out because of who you are a Pastor."
Woman Pastor: "Unwholesome talk did u read ur husbands words in his conversation about "Why is it that rap music is excepted ..." [this is my status on facebook, please see my status below] calling people old bags come on *my wife* why is it the truth in love is so hard to take.. There is a spirit of anger and rage behind that music in these last days we got to discerned Jesus said in Matt 24 do NOT be decieved and just cause I say something that isnt all mushy so called love doesnt mean its not love my friend love is strong unmovable a firm foundation sorry if it offends you. Blessing"
My Wife: "Yes I read what my husband said and he was angry I will not doubt that but you are a pastor you need to think before you speak. *Woman Pastor* best I can say for you is to not comment when you dont like something no one forced you to listen to it no one forced you to comment. Jason [Me] will reach souls if that is what Christ wants for him if he did not then this band would have not had the blessings that they have had. I have read some lyrics and have heard some testimonoes from these national bands and they are saving souls for the kingdom so please don't judge what you don't know."
Woman Pastor: "Sooo it is justifiable if ur husband calls names but if I because Im a Pastor tell the truth that obviously you both dont want to hear.(as its plastered on FB) Im all wrong a pastor shouldn't do that??? My judge is God not man. Sorry if you cant handle some one disagreeing.Or handle truth in love. I think ur hurts need to heal. And that happens by choosing forgivness for pat offenses not holding on to them and spewing hate. Blessings"
Me: "I read Matthew 24:10 and it doesn’t apply in this case because I haven’t turned away from Christ, I have never betrayed you and I don’t hate you.
As far as judging you, I am allowed to do that. I’m just not allowed to judge unbelievers, those who are outsiders of the church.
1 Corinthians 5:13-13 “It isn’t my responsibility to judge outsiders, but it certainly is your responsibility to judge those inside the church who are sinning. God will judge those on the outside.”
When you are prejudice against something you do not understand, you are being ungodly. Ungodliness is sinful and we should not be prejudice, or pre-judging, unless you have all the facts.
James 2:9 - “If you favor some people over others, you are committing a sin.” This does not apply just for people alone but being prejudice against anything, is ungodly.
John 7:24 - “Look beneath the surface so you can judge correctly.”
God is not partial towards the Greek or the Jew, rich or the poor. There is no favoritism in Him. But, for you to say that one particular style of music is evil and another is good is being prejudice. The fact is that styles of music cannot be evil or good, only people can be evil or good, not music. Music is a matter of preference, that’s it. Now, what people do with the music, such as adding evil lyrics and talking about evil and ungodly things, is a different matter. But, in this case the lyrics are righteous and godly.
You have not told the truth about anything except the truth about yourself. You have exposed yourself as being a hypocrite. You assume the role of a Pastor but you condemn others and their taste in music and what they do. You have done nothing but inadvertently condemned my band, our music and our ministry in a negative light. No wonder there will be thousands of "metal heads" in hell! Because people like you rejected them! Who are you to choose who goes to heaven and who goes to hell?
Angry emotions are not a bad thing. Jesus was led by his emotions when he got angry at the money changers in the Temple. He started turning over tables, yelling and screaming and trying to kick them all out! Was Jesus justified? Of course, because those people were wrong!
In 1 Samuel 11:6, “Then the Spirit of God came powerfully upon Saul, and he became very angry.” If God can make a man angry, then gosh darn it, it must be justified!
When people like you condemn ministries that reach out to the un-churched youth with the good news of Christ by means of metal music, I am justified in my anger because it’s wrong! It’s wrong to reject God working through us or any other Christian metal band to reach these lost people.
When churches reject a Christian metal band from showing up at an event because they growl, scream or have loud guitars and drums who come with Christian based lyrics, preaching the gospel and giving their testimonies of how God has changed their lives, then those churches are wrong! Who are they to reject a Christian ministry that reaches those who do listen to that kind of music? To do that, is prejudice! Remember, John 7:24 - “Look beneath the surface so you can judge correctly.”
Yeah, the only nerve you struck was the nerve of truth by exposing ignorant people like you who don’t know what the heck your doing leading a supposed “church.”
If you truly lived to please God then it would matter what people said about Christian metal music. If you really lived to please God you would rebuke those who speak against spreading the good news of Christ through this style of music and the testimonies of the band members. If you wanted to truly please God then you would defend ministries that are “on God’s side” that’s goal is to evangelize and reach those kids who will probably never step foot in an uppity, snooty, religious and condemning church. The usual response to those kinds of people and churches is, “Your hair is too long, your clothes are too freaky, you have a piercing on your eyebrow and lips, you have too many tattoos, you growl in your songs, you scream words and we can’t understand the lyrics, sorry you cannot be saved, you heathen; burn in hell!”
You should take this criticism as revealing because I come across people and churches like this all the time. They are negative, condemning and combative. They never uplift, they are not positive or encouraging. They mock what they do not understand and reject the true power of God working in the lives of the underground church. You scoff at what you do not know and you should humble yourself, repent and ask God to forgive you for your cynicism and negative attitude."
Me, again: "*Woman Pastor,*
Look, calling someone an “old bag” is not a sin, so get over it. Jesus called the Pharisees a “brood of vipers” right in front of their faces! However, when someone calls themselves a Pastor, they are held to a higher standard than the average church-going Christian who sits in the pews; you lost that privilege when you became a Pastor.
I live for the truth and I always support it. However, the only truth you presented here was exposing your negative and discouraging attitude towards a particular style of music that you do not like. If you simply would have said in the beginning, “Great lyrics but I don’t care for the style.” Then no harm done. However, when you mocked the style of music (which is what you really did) that I like with a statement like “What a mockery,” then I’m not going to let that go. Why? Because it’s a lie! This music, along with the wonderful lyrics are not a mockery but they glorify God; fully and wholly.
As I stated with *an old Navy friend of mine* and as anyone can see, I can disagree; I don’t have a problem with that! If you don’t particularly like this genre, I can understand that; but what you did was wrong and you need to repent. I have already forgiven you because you don’t know what you are doing by saying foolish things like that. I am not hurt as much as you think. However, my anger is justified because of what people say about things they are ignorant of. This is not hate towards you; I have no reason to hate you! However, I have concern for religious dogmatics like yourself who cannot see past the four walls of you church building. There are thousands of people out here dying and going to hell because churches and people like you ignore them or reject them because it’s not your style of music. Omgosh, get over it! I don’t like Country music, but I’m not going to reject it if it brings people to Christ! I just don’t prefer to listen to it. I would never mock it or condemn it because I didn’t like the style of music.
If hardcore/metal core bands brings people to know Christ by planting seeds of hope, watering those people with positive messages through the lyrics and great testimonies at shows and then offering a message of hope in a lost world by praying with these to receive Christ people in a concert, then why would any Christian speak badly or negative of it?!
Please burn me at the stake! I will scream and growl in the famous words of Joan of Arc, “Jesus, Jesus, Jesus!"
My 13yr. old Daughter: "I dislike people who judge, that means that the don't have anything else to do with there life but criticize people who are different from them.
*Woman Pastor, You being a pastor should accept people for who they are and what type of music they like, it doesn't make them any different from any of the rest of the people.
Hate is a strong word, To have a great aversion to, with a strong desire that evil should befall the person toward whom the feeling is directed; to dislike intensely; to detest; as, to hate one's enemies; to hate hypocrisy.
My pastor makes mistake and he admits them, on the podium.
He asks for forgiveness, he thanks God for forgiveness, he LOVES his church family. He may not like my father's music but he knows that its bringing other souls to the Lord.
I personally love my dad's music. My friend's don't like it, they are glad my dad's band is moving forward.
I'm defending my parents because I know they are Godly people who love God and love God's people.
God made everybody DIFFERENT in their own way!
I think we should respect that."
My Wife: "Well *Woman Pastor* as i have read in what Jason [Me] responded he never once called you names. You are wrong a pastor should not act this way. I have no hurts that need healing eithermaybe looking at yourself before making accusations is what needs to happen. I am in a loving relationship and as Christ tells us to be the loving support to our husbands and i am following that. I beleive that this is pointless to continue with you and I will not respond any further if you choose to come back then it will only be making you the pastor look childish "plastered here on facebook". I know the relationship that I myself, my husband, and my children have with Christ and I need not defend this anymore. Thank you and have a nice life."
Woman Pastor: "hmmmm interesting! Ill be praying for u all God bless."
Me: "Wow! Your piety and arrogance still shines through; even when you are completely speechless."
Woman Pastor: ";)"
Well, that's it folks. What a poor example of a Pastor with no backbone, no humility and absolutley no concern for truth or the unsaved. I'm not re-posting this to ruin her. I'm doing this to OPEN your eyes and her eyes too!! Wake up America, your life will pass you by and your meaning in life will too if you do not answer the call and bury your hatred and prejudices!
My Status on Monday at 5:19 pm, 2010: "Why is it that Christian Rap is accepted, Christian Rock is accepted, Christian Country is accepted but when you mention the word Christian "metal," everyone freaks out and calls you a demonic band? I just don't get it."
Me: "When people hear a vocalist scream, yell or growl (whatever you want to call it) they automatically associate this type of vocalization of words with demons. The problem is, I can't figure out why?
What I want to know is, have these people ever heard a real demon scream? I mean seriously, I have never come across a demon in my lifetime... See More, at least as far as I know, and I certainly have never heard an actually demon scream or growl. So, do we really know what demons sound like and do we we even know that they scream? These are all stupid questions.
My point is that the music, the sound, the guitar, the vocals or the noise coming from a group of guys playing instruments loudly and fast does not qualify as demonic. At the very least it may qualify as terrible to some folks but demonic, I don't think so. Seriously, have we ever seen a real band of demons? Last time I checked, there has never been an actual band that had actual demons from hell, win a grammy for "Best Demonic Band?" Gimme a frigg'n break!
I guess it's Hollywood's fault. They have personified demonic voices in movies so much that when people hear a scream or growl, its automatically assumed that it's got to be demonic, even though they haven't a clue of what is being actually spoken!
I can scream or growl John 3:16 to an audience and someone will say, "Ohh, that's demonic! It must be bad because I can't understand it! Rediculous. :-("
Woman Pastor: "wow calling people old bags and idiots Matthew 5:22 amp! But i say to you (Jesus Speaking) that everyone who continues to be angry with his brother or harbors malice (enmity of heart) against him shall be liable to and unable to escape the punishment imposed by the Sanhedrin, and whoever says, you fool! [You empty headed idiot!] shall be liable to and unable to escape the hell(Gehenna) of fire!
matthew 24 do not be decieved!!! Everyone saying Lord Lord will enter the kingdom! Jason ask ur self why ur so angry and this "music" u defend sooo passionitly feeds your anger. Let God heal your hurts and heart. its not about the music its about your heart!"
Me: "As I stated in my other post, calling people "old bags" is not a sin. Even calling someone an "idiot" is not a sin. Matthew 5:22 says, "If you call someone an idiot, you are in danger of being brought before the court."
All this says is that my actions of calling someone an idiot, may be out of line. However, I feel I am justified because anybody who continues in discussing things they are clearly clueless about, must be an idiot or just plain stupid. Jesus clearly called the Pharisees plenty of names and he said it to their faces! So, if Jesus can say it, then I can say it. If he is justified, then I am justified.
I'm not angry at my brother and anyone else for that matter. I am angry at the fact that people like you make ignorant comments on things that they are clueless about. You don't know anything about Christian metal. You "think" you know something, but who do you think knows more, you or me? I am in a band that plays it, I attend the concerts and I see people being influenced for Christ. I see people giving testimonies of how Christ changed their lives and now they live to serve Christ. I have even seen "unbelievers" worshipping God! Try that at church next Sunday!
What have you seen? Absolutely nothing and only what you want to see because you don't want to see the truth of the gospel of Christ working in the lives of these people. Like I said, you are clueless.
If someone makes a comment about something that they have no earthly idea of what they are talking about, and they continue to discuss it, then they are truly an idiot! If you don't have enough common sense to shut up about something you don't know anything about, then you are an idiot.
The music I listen to does NOT feed my anger (in which I have none), what makes me justifiably angry are people who think they know better than God. I am angry at what Jesus got angry about, which is pride, arrogance, piety and people who are so self-righteous, they can't even see their own failures.
The reason I am now able to express my true thoughts to you is because I am no longer afraid of man. Once you come to intimate knowledge of, understand and know the fear of God, man is no more a threat to me. I could care less what any man thinks of me because I know what God thinks of me and what He thinks of me is all that matters. I don't care if you hate me, I don't care what any man thinks of me. I am not here to please man, I aim to please God and what He has for me in my life.
I am healed in Jesus name and I don't need you telling what's wrong with me, I have Jesus for that. Jesus has changed my heart. That's why I am telling you these truths that you need to pay attention too!
As I stated before, I do NOT hate you or anyone else. I am NOT angry at anyone, only the situation. If it's not about the music, then why did you call "How Great Thou Art" by Becoming the Archtype a "mockery?"
Yes, it's not about the music, that's what I have been trying to tell you!It's about Jesus, nothing else!
I just want you to know one thing, it is completely out of love that I've said this."
This something I want to point out. Woman Pastor originally says, "What a mockery" about the music video I posted. Then much later on my status, she says "its not about the music its about your heart!" If it's not about then the music then whay did she say, "What a mockery" in the beginning of this conversation?
I can tell you why. It's because she is a liar and a hypocrite. She focuses strictly on the music and does not even consider the lyrics. Let's face it, she does not like "metal" music! Why doesn't she just admit it?!
You see folks, these kind of so-called "Christians" are the false ones. They pretend to be Christian but underneath, they judge people, have prejudices against certain types of music, certain clothes you wear, certain types of tattoos, etc, etc, and if you don't fit inside their little mold that they have created in their own little perfect religious world then you must not be worthy of salvation, even though Christ thought different.
One day in heaven, God will ask Woman Pastor, "Why did you reject these people because of the type of music they listened too? Didn't someone tell you that this was all about my Son, Jesus the Christ, the Messiah? Why didn't you listen and gain understanding from this situation? Did not my words of truth reign in your heart? Or, did you worry too much about your preferences and what you liked versus what I gave you to use? My dear child, you are a selfish one, into the consuming fire with you and pray that your deeds and works are not consumed as purely stubble and hay."
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Monday, July 19, 2010
Christian Metal Demonic?
Why is it that Christian Rap is accepted, Christian Rock is accepted, Christian Country is accepted but when you mention the word Christian "metal," everyone freaks out and calls it a demonic band? I just don't get it.
When people hear a Christian hardcore/metal vocalist scream, yell or growl (whatever you want to call it) they automatically associate this type of vocalization of words with demons. The problem is, I can't figure out why?
What I want to know is, have these people ever heard a real demon scream? I mean seriously, I have never come across a demon in my lifetime, at least as far as I know, and I certainly have never heard an actually demon scream or growl. So, do we really know what demons sound like and do we we even know that they scream? These are all stupid questions.
My point is that the music, the sound, the guitar, the vocals or the noise coming from a group of guys playing instruments loudly and fast does not qualify as demonic. At the very least it may qualify as terrible to some folks but demonic, I don't think so.
Seriously, have we ever seen a real band of demons? Last time I checked, there has never been an actual band that had actual demons from hell, win a grammy for "Best Demonic Band?" Gimme a frigg'n break!
I guess it's Hollywood's fault. They have personified demonic voices in movies so much that when people hear a scream or growl, its automatically assumed that it's got to be demonic, even though they haven't a clue of what is being actually spoken!
I can recite by a scream or growl the famous verse of John 3:16 to an audience and someone will say, "Ohh, that's demonic! It must be bad because I can't understand it!
Rediculous.
When people hear a Christian hardcore/metal vocalist scream, yell or growl (whatever you want to call it) they automatically associate this type of vocalization of words with demons. The problem is, I can't figure out why?
What I want to know is, have these people ever heard a real demon scream? I mean seriously, I have never come across a demon in my lifetime, at least as far as I know, and I certainly have never heard an actually demon scream or growl. So, do we really know what demons sound like and do we we even know that they scream? These are all stupid questions.
My point is that the music, the sound, the guitar, the vocals or the noise coming from a group of guys playing instruments loudly and fast does not qualify as demonic. At the very least it may qualify as terrible to some folks but demonic, I don't think so.
Seriously, have we ever seen a real band of demons? Last time I checked, there has never been an actual band that had actual demons from hell, win a grammy for "Best Demonic Band?" Gimme a frigg'n break!
I guess it's Hollywood's fault. They have personified demonic voices in movies so much that when people hear a scream or growl, its automatically assumed that it's got to be demonic, even though they haven't a clue of what is being actually spoken!
I can recite by a scream or growl the famous verse of John 3:16 to an audience and someone will say, "Ohh, that's demonic! It must be bad because I can't understand it!
Rediculous.
Sunday, July 18, 2010
Proof that God Loves Christian Metal Music
Psalm 27:6 – “Then I will hold my head high above my enemies who surround me. At his sanctuary I will offer sacrifices with shouts of joy, singing and praising the Lord with music (NLT).”
Ps 33:3 – “Sing to him a new song; play skillfully on the strings, with loud shouts (ESV).”
Ps 98:4 - “Make a joyful noise unto the LORD, all the earth: make a loud noise, and rejoice, and sing praise (KJV).”
Psalm 144:9 – “I will sing a new song unto Thee, O God; upon a psaltery and an instrument of ten strings will I sing praises unto Thee (21st Century KJV).”
Psalm 150:5 – “Praise him with a clash of cymbals; praise him with loud clanging cymbals (NLT).”
The Message
Ps 33:3 – “Good people, cheer God! Right-living people sound best when praising. Use guitars to reinforce your Hallelujahs! Play his praise on a grand piano! Invent your own new song to him; give him a trumpet fanfare (The Message).”
Psalm 47:1 – “Applause, everyone. Bravo, bravissimo! Shout God-songs at the top of your lungs! God Most High is stunning, astride land and ocean. He crushes hostile people, puts nations at our feet. He set us at the head of the line, prize-winning Jacob, his favorite. Loud cheers as God climbs the mountain, a ram's horn blast at the summit. Sing songs to God, sing out! Sing to our King, sing praise! He's Lord over earth, so sing your best songs to God. God is Lord of godless nations— sovereign, he's King of the mountain. Princes from all over are gathered, people of Abraham's God. The powers of earth are God's— he soars over all (The Message).”
Psalm 144:9 – “O God, let me sing a new song to you, let me play it on a twelve-string guitar— A song to the God who saved the king, the God who rescued David, his servant (The Message).”
Ps 33:3 – “Sing to him a new song; play skillfully on the strings, with loud shouts (ESV).”
Ps 98:4 - “Make a joyful noise unto the LORD, all the earth: make a loud noise, and rejoice, and sing praise (KJV).”
Psalm 144:9 – “I will sing a new song unto Thee, O God; upon a psaltery and an instrument of ten strings will I sing praises unto Thee (21st Century KJV).”
Psalm 150:5 – “Praise him with a clash of cymbals; praise him with loud clanging cymbals (NLT).”
The Message
Ps 33:3 – “Good people, cheer God! Right-living people sound best when praising. Use guitars to reinforce your Hallelujahs! Play his praise on a grand piano! Invent your own new song to him; give him a trumpet fanfare (The Message).”
Psalm 47:1 – “Applause, everyone. Bravo, bravissimo! Shout God-songs at the top of your lungs! God Most High is stunning, astride land and ocean. He crushes hostile people, puts nations at our feet. He set us at the head of the line, prize-winning Jacob, his favorite. Loud cheers as God climbs the mountain, a ram's horn blast at the summit. Sing songs to God, sing out! Sing to our King, sing praise! He's Lord over earth, so sing your best songs to God. God is Lord of godless nations— sovereign, he's King of the mountain. Princes from all over are gathered, people of Abraham's God. The powers of earth are God's— he soars over all (The Message).”
Psalm 144:9 – “O God, let me sing a new song to you, let me play it on a twelve-string guitar— A song to the God who saved the king, the God who rescued David, his servant (The Message).”
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